al-ko tow hitch

[(RIP) PLANK]

the last 3 litre diesel, with the self destruct engine was the only one we didnt have, i understand they were very powerfull, but i never felt like taking a chance on one. the 2.8 td's were good but the 3.1 tdi's lacked the all round ability i would expect from such a big vehicle.

having said that if 4x4's is what your used to towing with you may not otice the difference as they are nearly all fairly unstable, and only benefit you once on the wet camp site. I think 4x4's do come into their own when towing very heavy trailers as they do have the tourque for it, but caravans arent really that heavy as trailers go. I basically a big empty box for the wind to blow around.

having said all that i do tow large caravans with 4x4's all the time so im not knocking them! its just be wary as they do seem to make for a more unstable caravan than some other vehilces!

[(RIP) PLANK]

out of interest ths is worth a look at!

http://www.whattowcar.com/

stick in your caravan and car combo and get their towing match opinion!

[andrewk]

Originally Posted by PLANK

the last 3 litre diesel, with the self destruct engine was the only one we didnt have

Quite a few self-destructed, but in the end Isuzu paid for replacement injectors which fixed the problem. They also paid for new engines to replace blown ones - at least, they did if you asked nicely. It all got a bit easier when Caterpillar (who designed the injectors) accepted liability. Mine ran for 120,000 miles whilst I had it with no problem at all.

Powerful? Maybe - but I think that apart from being a bit gruffer sounding the 3.0Di in the Patrol just might be a bit better - more torque at lower engine revs and a bit smoother, not as strained at high speed. It'll pull 30mph in 5th on the flat or on a slight incline with no problem at all. I'd have been in 4th at 30mph in the Trooper.

I've only towed the caravan a couple of times with the Patrol - from home to Todmorden & back, to take the van in for a service at MG Caravans. Not much of a test - but I'm pretty optimistic. I'm going to Cruachan Farm on Loch Tay for Easter - towing 600 miles round trip should give me a much better feel both for how the Patrol tows and for diesel consumption.

having said that if 4x4's is what your used to towing with you may not otice the difference as they are nearly all fairly unstable

I'm sure this is a wind-up. :smile: :smile:

I towed the same Lunar caravan with four different motors over a period of 14 years - three of which were NOT 4x4s. The Trooper was several classes better than the next best, which was a (newish) Peugeot 406 saloon. So much better in fact that I gave away the Bulldog 200Q stabiliser I used with the Pug. It no longer had a purpose (if it ever really had anyway). Did you ever consider replacing the dampers in any of these wobble-boxes that you've owned?

i do tow large caravans with 4x4's all the time so im not knocking them! its just be wary as they do seem to make for a more unstable caravan than some other vehilces!

Like I said, maybe your Trooper(s?) were not on top form - but mine was actually better with a van on the back than it was solo. Slower - but less roll and less understeer on corners. Some 4x4s are relatively unstable towing caravans but they're mostly made in the midlands - not in Japan. :smile:

Cheers
Andrew

[(RIP) PLANK]

i'm never going to hear the end of this am i AndrewK? Is this a wind Up?

just pointing out a simple factbased on experience of towing different caravans with different vehicles on a weekly sometimes daily basis, if you dont agree thats your choice :wink:

i ran two 2.8tds good trucks but no where as good as a nissan 2.7td let alone the 3.0l.
good on izuzy on there 3l recall our local dealer was full of em,wheras nissan deny any fault with navara d22 2.5 engine chargin 8k for new engine

[andrewk]

Originally Posted by jace

good on izuzy on there 3l recall our local dealer was full of em

They replaced the injectors FoC on every Trooper in the UK with the Euro2 3.0D engine over a 2 year program. Mine had already done 100K miles when the new injectors were fitted.

Cheers
Andrew

more than nissan are doing there still denying the problem using every trick in book to wriggle outve warranty 1k over service sorry sir warranty void!
http://picasaweb.google.co.uk/WARSTA...nNavaraBigEnds

[andrewk]

Originally Posted by jace

more than nissan are doing there still denying the problem using every trick in book to wriggle outve warranty 1k over service sorry sir warranty void!
http://picasaweb.google.co.uk/WARSTA...nNavaraBigEnds

I didn't know there was a problem with the Navara engine. I knew about the early 3.0Di Patrol engines melting pistons.

Isuzu owners had a big problem for several years. Isuzu didn't accept liability either. It was Caterpillar who designed the injectors and funded the recall costs. It was only after Caterpillar accepted liability that Isuzu arranged the recall - which, AFAIK, has completely fixed the problem.

Cheers
Andrew

[andrewk]

Originally Posted by PLANK

just pointing out a simple factbased on experience

I always thought it was opinion that was based on experience - not fact. My opinion appears to be different from yours, because it is based upon different experiences. It is based upon towing the same caravan with a number of different vehicles including an Isuzu Trooper, all of which were new (or almost in the Troopers case) when they first towed the van - so the caravan was a constant and differences in towing behaviour were down to the towcar only. The towcars were all serviced by franchised main dealers irrespective of cost (three of the towcars were company cars) and in two cases had shock absorbers changed (inc the Trooper) when needed.

My opinion, FWIW, is based upon samples of the towcars known to be in good condition. On that basis, a MKIV Trooper is an excellent towcar and IMHO is not likely to be significantly beaten by any other passenger car that I am aware of or ever likely to own. Having said that, the Patrol seems good too - but I've only towed with it a couple of times, so I'm not sure yet quite how good.

Have fun
Andrew

oh yes navaras even the latest ones have had numerous faults the enginge letting go at low milages is denied at all costs,my trucks engine was rebuilt by nissan with 4 new pistons at cost of over two grand with 43k on the clock! im dreading the odometer hitting 86k lol

[andrewk]

Originally Posted by jace

oh yes navaras even the latest ones have had numerous faults the enginge letting go at low milages is denied at all costs,my trucks engine was rebuilt by nissan with 4 new pistons at cost of over two grand with 43k on the clock! im dreading the odometer hitting 86k lol

The Trooper's mode of failure was quite different. The problem was that the seals in the injectors were inclined to fail. When they did, diesel just ran uncontrolled into the combustion chambers - and the engine just revved until it bust. Switching the engine off had no effect and it usually wasn't possible to stall it before it expired, even if you realised what was happening.

One of the changes in the 3.0Di Patrol engine, intended to fix it's provclivity for melting pistons, was an increase in the engine oil capacity & size of the sump by a couple of litres. Guess what - Westway Nissan at Stockport, when they serviced the Patrol that I bought from them (before delivery), put two litres too little engine oil in when they changed it. It wasn't even showing on the dipstick. I think you'd be right if you were to surmise that they won't be servicing it again!!

So, some Nissan engines are a bit delicate and sometimes blow up. If they don't blow up, their franchise dealers will do their best to make them do. Oh .......... was it really such a good idea to buy a Nissan?

Mmmm ......... I'll let you know in due course, but at the moment, I'm still very positive about the Patrol.

Cheers
Andrew

it aint nissan anymore its reno and lot navara fellas saying theres the down fall cost cutting to try recoup there outlay and streamline the buisness,even so d still buy nissan there more powerfull than anything else out there!

[(RIP) PLANK]

Originally Posted by andrewk

I always thought it was opinion that was based on experience - not fact. My opinion appears to be different from yours, because it is based upon different experiences. It is based upon towing the same caravan with a number of different vehicles including an Isuzu Trooper, all of which were new (or almost in the Troopers case) when they first towed the van - so the caravan was a constant and differences in towing behaviour were down to the towcar only. The towcars were all serviced by franchised main dealers irrespective of cost (three of the towcars were company cars) and in two cases had shock absorbers changed (inc the Trooper) when needed.

My opinion, FWIW, is based upon samples of the towcars known to be in good condition. On that basis, a MKIV Trooper is an excellent towcar and IMHO is not likely to be significantly beaten by any other passenger car that I am aware of or ever likely to own. Having said that, the Patrol seems good too - but I've only towed with it a couple of times, so I'm not sure yet quite how good.

Have fun
Andrew

Andrew, i dont know why you keep up with the wordy reoplies, my opinion of late troopers was simply this, I wasn't prepared to take a chance on one so never owned one, simple as that! and your based on it being yours and your bought brand new pride and joy, which is fair enough!

I was simply pointiong put this fact ot others as there does seem to be a miscinception regarding 4x4's and caravans! Not a personal attack on you or your troper which i am sure was fantastic as were all the others so no need to be so defensive!

despite this generaly speaking, 4x4's are not neccesarily the best and most stable towing vehicles for towing caravans, a fact backed by my experience the experience of many others and virtualy all tests done be caravan and camping club, caravan club etc. As basicalyy they were designed for off road driving with big ground clearance and suspension articulation, bouncy tyres andsuspension for soaking up off road bumps. the caravan was not! and doesnt sit as comfortably behind many 4x4's as it does behind many other vehicles.

4x4's fpr towing caravans have become more popular in recent years and caravans size to weight ratio has reduced, and there are more diffferent makes of stabilisers on the market than ever! I wonder why?

I would say most members here have older cars that have not had main dealer service histories (though who checked the oil wouldnt affect towing would it?) and probably oder caravans to go with them, and many are first time caravaners or new to 4x4 towing. The other group is those who have never towed with anything else so can't compare.

sensibly approached most cars can tow most caravans adequately, but all have their own charecteristics as do caravans, The Lunar you pointed out is a good example, they have allways been very stable caravans despite being some of the lightest on the market, however do suffer a bit from the dreaded damp! but everythng is a compromises just like a 4x4 realy, dont you think?

on road ability compromised by off road ability and visa versa? and this compromise also shows when towing! paticulary towing a caravan.

[andrewk]

Originally Posted by jace

it aint nissan anymore its reno and lot navara fellas saying theres the down fall cost cutting to try recoup there outlay and streamline the buisness,even so d still buy nissan there more powerfull than anything else out there!

If you are into pickups, the 3.0D Isuzu Rodeo Denver double-cab is supposed to be the business (different engne - not from the Trooper) - at least, the mags say it's the most car-like of the pickups. I had an automatic one for a day as a courtesy car when the Trooper was in for service. It was ......... not very good. Slow, very noisy, small (inside), poor ride and rather uncomfortable.


Cheers
Andrew

[andrewk]

Originally Posted by PLANK

The Lunar you pointed out is a good example, they have allways been very stable caravans despite being some of the lightest on the market, however do suffer a bit from the dreaded damp!

Mine certainly did.

Cheers
Andrew

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